tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post5825601425576286390..comments2024-02-08T07:19:54.565-05:00Comments on Quantumleap42: Why did Mormon name Abish?Quantumleap42http://www.blogger.com/profile/16711817313734546305noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post-42667510909095184602015-01-07T19:08:03.191-05:002015-01-07T19:08:03.191-05:00Side note: there is a 6th woman named in the Book ...Side note: there is a 6th woman named in the Book of Mormon: Sarah, wife of Abraham. 2 Nephi 8:2cspokeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09947593802321018450noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post-19745079070170005022012-12-30T00:08:01.077-05:002012-12-30T00:08:01.077-05:00Bill, that is one interpretation that I never thou...Bill, that is one interpretation that I never thought about. I think it comes in the ambiguous use of the word "of". Does the sense of "of" here imply ownership (the father's dream) or as subject (the father was the subject of the vision). I think this is something that cannot be cleared up without looking at the original text, because in other languages it will be equally ambiguous (as is the case with Spanish) or it will be subject to the bias of the translator. Meaning is the language that it is being translated into can render the phrase so that it is not ambiguous then how it gets translated is up to the translator.<br /><br />I came across something similar with the phrase "rolled together as a scroll" that appears in the Book of Mormon. In English the phrase is not ambiguous (other than the general "What in the world does that mean?!?!?"), but in Spanish the phrase is ambiguous. The Spanish is, "se plegará como un rollo", which, as one of my Argentine companions pointed out to me, literally means "to come unstuck like a scroll". The important thing here is direction. In English it is clear, the direction is to come together like a scroll being rolled up (direction from flat to rolled). But in Spanish it just says "to come unstuck" which means it could go either direction (from rolled up to flat, or from flat to rolled up). So something that is unambiguous in English is ambiguous when translated into Spanish.<br /><br />In my case I could appeal to English to establish a direction, but in this case the most original translation is ambiguous so we can't appeal to anything higher, except the original text, which we don't have. Sigh.Quantumleap42https://www.blogger.com/profile/16711817313734546305noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post-5683925542670035572012-12-29T23:45:40.807-05:002012-12-29T23:45:40.807-05:00I always thought it was interesting how when it sa...I always thought it was interesting how when it said that she had been "converted unto the Lord for many years, on account of a remarkable vision of her father" it is ambiguous as to who had the vision of whom/what. In other words, was it Abish's father (presumably alive at the time) having a vision of angels (or whatever), or was it Abish having a vision of her father (who in this case would have been deceased at the time). Both seem to me to fit with the text, and both would make sense. Does anyone know of any commentaries/other language translations that clear this up? Anyways, great post as always. Bill Evansnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post-22613150341986111142012-11-28T12:53:03.833-05:002012-11-28T12:53:03.833-05:00i'm glad he does use her name. she is one of m...i'm glad he does use her name. she is one of my favorite characters and her story is very powerful. i often referred to her on my mission as an example of a part-member or less-active family in the scriptures. <br /><br />like with enos - the example of a righteous parent who shares his/her testimony is powerful. robin mariehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10343124054802646722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post-15984679096858611752012-11-26T23:29:48.928-05:002012-11-26T23:29:48.928-05:00You may/may not wish to weigh in on a discussion I...You may/may not wish to weigh in on a discussion I had with my home teacher on the subject of having one's calling and election made sure.<br /><br />He referred to a conference talk by Bruce McConkie (March 25, 1969), which doesn't address the issue at all. <br /><br />My reference is to John 13 and the first part of 14 where we, the reader, witness a priesthood ordinance. In every priesthood ordinance (blessing sacrament, baptism, confirmation, etc.) there are four parts: (1) Invocation (2) Commandment (3) Blessing associated with keeping the commandment (4) Physical Aspect - In baptism burial and resurrection in water - in confirmation, you RECEIVE the Holy Ghost and in the case of the sacrament, you take bread and water symbolically. <br /><br />Each of those aspects are also present in the Endowment.<br /><br />However, the ordinance in John 13-14 (a NEW commandment I give unto you that ye love one another as I have loved you) and blessing John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father and he shall give you another comforter, that he may abide with you forever (17) Even the Spirit of Truth whom the world can not receive because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him, for he dwelleth with you and shall be in you - makes it clear that it's an ordinance.LLhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05538854359365988863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1249869099945727276.post-16572912448003111122012-11-26T19:05:39.868-05:002012-11-26T19:05:39.868-05:00Proper names in many cultures have special meaning...Proper names in many cultures have special meaning and apply to a particular person. Thus <b><i>Ab</i></b> {in Arabic, Abu] (father) a prefix of sorts at least in Hebrew, and the suffix <b><i>"ish"</i> </b>, which could have many meanings now lost to us.<br /><br />I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that it means daughter - or daughter of her possibly famous father. <br /><br />We have Mahonri Moriacumer (the Brother of Jared), who may have been known as the Brother of Jared either because Jared was more noteworthy at the time or because the people felt more comfortable with it than Mahonri Moriancumer. (Who knows?)<br /><br />Historically surnames in both Korean (very structured), Russian and Scandanavian are all based on a patronymic. Lars' son becomes Larson, Peter's son becomes Peterson/Petersen, etc. It's less true in the Middle East and we don't see that pattern often in the Book of Mormon - but as you pointed out, we don't have any information on the women. It may have been common.<br /><br />Turning to Spanish (and I know that you're familiar with the language), there are patronymics and matronymics with each name in common use. <br /><br />ie - Jose Salazar (patronymic) Gomez (matronymic). The personal name therefore becomes an amalgamation of two families who produced the person. In English the closest we come is jr/sr and a numerical accounting John Doe III son of John Doe II, etc.<br /><br />But then again, I said that I was reaching.LLhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05538854359365988863noreply@blogger.com